Patrick Bass Show
The Patrick Bass Show - your gateway to uncovering the extraordinary. Join us live every weekday from 5 PM to 6 PM as we explore the mysteries that shape our world. Each episode features top guests from diverse backgrounds, engaging in thought-provoking discussions that challenge the status quo and push the boundaries of conventional thinking.
Whether we’re exploring the paranormal, questioning the frontiers of science, or probing the depths of human consciousness, every episode offers a captivating journey into the unknown. With an active toll-free line at 855-605-8255, you’re invited to participate, share your stories, theories, and experiences, and become part of the conversation.
Hosted by Patrick Bass—a veteran of talk radio and podcasting, and former host of the top 5% podcast Insight Radio—this show combines edgy, unapologetic insight with dynamic listener interaction. Patrick’s extensive expertise, backed by advanced degrees in computer science, business, strategy, and religious studies, brings a unique perspective that enriches every discussion.
Available on podcast networks everywhere, The Patrick Bass Show is more than just a podcast; it's a community for those who seek to explore the deeper truths of our world. Visit pwbass.com for more information and don’t miss out on the conversation—join us and become part of a movement that refuses to accept the ordinary.
Patrick Bass Show
Guy Morris's Remarkable Journey: Triumph Over Adversity, AI Challenges, and the Future of Digital Reality
Imagine overcoming complex PTSD and imposter syndrome to achieve academic excellence and professional success. That's Guy's reality. In this episode, we examine the transformative impact of a supportive family and unwavering self-belief, key factors that helped Guy navigate financial and emotional hurdles to earn multiple degrees and recognition in macroeconomics. His story beautifully illustrates the intersection of personal growth, resilience, and the indispensable role of supportive relationships in overcoming adversity and achieving great heights.
Artificial Intelligence isn't just a buzzword—it's a complex and potentially dangerous reality. Inspired by Michael Crichton, Guy Morris sheds light on the alarming future of AI, digital currencies, and global power dynamics. From his award-winning web series "Cracks in the Web" to the espionage thriller "Swarm," Guy shares his deep research into early AI systems and the prophetic implications of this rapidly evolving technology. This episode is a wake-up call about the ethical and strategic concerns tied to AI, urging us to reconsider the trajectory of our digital future. Fasten your seatbelts for an eye-opening conversation that challenges our perceptions and provokes critical thought about the world we are building.
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Speaker 2:Uh-oh, we're live. This is the Patrick Bass Show on the Vanguard Radio Network, and so glad that you're on this incredible magic carpet ride with us into the unknown. We've got another great guest lined up for you this afternoon and somebody I think you're going to really, really enjoy meeting. And I also want to remind you we had an unscheduled episode this morning when we met Jennifer Dees, a teacher that we're helping. So go on pwbasscom and scroll down just a little bit and you'll find out everything that we're doing to try and help her get her class ready for this year. Thanks so much for doing that.
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Speaker 2:Welcome back to the program. A little Black Betty Ram Jam right there to get things cooking. Hope you're having a good day on this Monday afternoon. I temporarily forgot what time zone I'm in, where I'm at, what's going on, what Listen? Hey, today on the show we have a guest whose life kind of reads like an adventure novel From Fortune 100 boardrooms to shark diving. He was homeless as a child. Corporate jets he's done it all. Guy Morris. He's a retired executive, he's a songwriter, he's an inventor, he's a charter captain. Now he's an author of thrillers. I don't know what we're going to talk about. There's so much here. But anyway, welcome to the show, guy. How's it going?
Speaker 4:Thank you, patrick. Anyway, welcome to the show, guy. How's it going? Thank you, patrick. I'm happy to be here. I hope I'm ready for all of this. I certainly have a pretty wide assortment of things that we could take pot shots at. Adventure novel is probably the first time I've heard that particular description, but I guess that fits and you know it's interesting. I never really even thought about the diversity and the, the diversity and the breadth of things that I've, I've, I've done and accomplished and experienced in life until I actually started doing a lot of interviews and podcasts and it started coming out. But I think that makes me somewhat of a um, I'm not sure if it makes me a diversified person or a very confused person, but uh, uh, but they all kind of wrap up, all those voices kind of wrap up in there somewhere.
Speaker 2:I kind of get it because I've done a lot of different weird things too. In fact, if you looked at my bio you're like this guy's gotta be a liar, but it's all true. So I get it. Guys like us, we're diverse, we're like modern Renaissance men, you know.
Speaker 4:And when I was in college now as a, I was was a homeless runaway at 13. I got my GED at 15, but I was still functioning illiterate. So when I entered college it was a shot in the dark. It was a leap off the cliff. Everybody that I knew was like, oh, you're so courageous to try.
Speaker 4:But one of the things that really triggered me in college was learning about the men of the Renaissance, who were men of science, who were men of politics, who were men of the arts, who were men of religion. They were very well-balanced, diversified people and it gave them a unique perspective on the problems of the world that specialists didn't get, because they're always looking at feeling one piece of the elephant only. And I think I had. I made the decision right then and there that while I was being counseled that I needed to specialize in a field I kind of did, but not so narrow that it didn't allow me to move around, and I think that was a really important thing, for my life is to be able to be good enough and enough things that I could put different pieces together.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, I get it. And let me, let me ask you a question, because guys like us, I think we're kind of the exception, not the rule. Guys like us, I think we're kind of the exception, not the rule, and when I think back on my life, I think about some of the things that I've done.
Speaker 4:Sometimes it's almost like I read a book about a guy that did that. Can you relate? Yes, yeah, so that was another life. You know, I'm not sure I was, I'm sure it wasn't a reincarnation, but just feels like another life, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, out of all the things you've done?
Speaker 4:do you have a favorite, A favorite other?
Speaker 2:life Sure, why not?
Speaker 4:Of those phases? Yeah, it was when I was living on a boat and going on deep sea dives and diving with sharks and sea rays and um, um and feeding sharks and taking people. I had a beautiful um, 50 foot, uh, 49 foot overall, uh, t cons Christian. That was so beautiful it was. Uh, it was featured in a couple of Disney episodes, uh, and it was put it using commercials and I would take people out on charters, which is why I got the Coast Guard charter captain license and it was just a.
Speaker 4:It was probably the one time in my life where I was. That was also the time when I was, I did contract songwriting for Disney. I was living near the beach, I was bike riding every single day, practically doing lots of traveling, and I think it was probably the time in my life when that phase when you go from survival mode to trying to build something mode, to trying to resurrect what you destroyed, what you built mode, to finally getting to a point where you're just trying to enjoy life a little bit, Wow, and you're exploring the things, you're trying to figure out who you are as an individual by exploring the things that you love to do and in doing so, you wind up meeting, I think, some of the people that become most important in your life.
Speaker 2:I agree, but I have a question for you. How does a guy and these are your words, you said you were a 15 year old, functionally illiterate person how did you go from that guy to the guy on a 50 foot boat writing songs for Disney? There's a story there. There's got to be what happened.
Speaker 4:I married young. I left home at 15. I ended up in a Christian commune in Tucson, arizona. I lasted in the commune about three months because of all of my complex post-traumatic stress syndromes. That I still was, that I it wasn't wouldn't be till I was in my 50s that that would be diagnosed. But I have a hard time feeling connected to people, feeling safe and in unfamiliar places. It was a. I was having daily issues and I finally moved out and got a job, but I still kept going to the church and I got married.
Speaker 4:I was part of a coffee house because I was a musician. I worked at a local Christian coffee house and that's where I met my first wife. We would serve food and then we would all do a set and that was getting me to explore my musical talents and that creative skills. And for the longest time I was convinced that the only skill I ever had was music and that was the only way I was ever going to make any money and questioning whether or not I was good enough to do that. But that's where I met her and we got married. Too young she got pregnant right away, not expected, and all of a sudden I had this crisis point in my life. This flexion point was like, okay, now you're not just this bum kid who can live in a crappy trailer and get away with it, now you've got to support a family, a wife and a daughter. And she actually had come from money. So I wasn't, I was trying to. I was feeling a little bit not, you know, I was feeling very much like I had over married over my head and so I. It was a very, very strange story. You won't believe it, but I felt impressed in prayer to go to to apply to college, and it was absolutely astounded that they accepted me. I had to get my ex-wife's help to actually complete the application, and so it was sort of this one of those. I'm just going to do this because I feel like I'm supposed to do it, but I have no expectation that it's going to succeed. I don't know why I'm doing this at all. Why am I doing this kind of experience Three weeks later and, by the way, this was the early part of late July, early August, when this was happening School the University of Arizona started in late August, early September, if I remember, and there was no way I had no SAT scores.
Speaker 4:I didn't have a copy of my transcripts. There was no way I was going to get in, but I did it anyway and beyond all odds I got in. And then the very next day I got a letter from my father-in-law and I hadn't told anybody I was doing this because I was expecting total failure. But I got a letter from my father-in-law saying that he really felt that I'd had a crappy childhood and I didn't have any chances in life and if I was willing to work hard and still support the family, he would be willing to pay for my tuition and books if I wanted to consider college. I got that letter the day after I got the acceptance letter from the college and threw it away. So I'm rifling through the trash, down in the trash bin, trying to get our trash bag to find that letter so I can follow up on it.
Speaker 4:And for the first few years of school I was struggling. I was. I was working pretty much full time. I was taking 22 units of credit. I was barely getting by with C's and D's and thinking this was a horrible, horrible mistake. But you know I was.
Speaker 4:It was starting to grow and somewhere around that second year I can't, I couldn't tell you what something clicked and I started getting it.
Speaker 4:I started getting the study habits, I started being able to read better, I started being able to understand what I was reading. And I start at. The acceleration curve was pretty astounding at that point, because I got a scholarship and I ended up with multiple degrees because I was just working obsessively hard trying to prove that I wasn't as stupid as everyone had told me I was my whole life. And then I wound up with multiple degrees and then I got a full scholarship to grad school and then I also got accepted to Harvard MBA program because I had developed a macroeconomic model that outperformed the Federal Reserve and changed how we build macroeconomic models to this day and that got a lot of people's attention, including my own. But for years I I still had imposter system because I thought, well, that was just, that was just lucky. I just, I just came across a lucky theory, a lucky idea, and it panned out Um, and it took me years before I finally accepted that I did it. I wasn't that I was um, that I had earned it.
Speaker 2:Wow, so you get accepted to school. Throw it away Cause you're like there's no way I can afford this, I guess, right.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I had no money, I was still working. I was working full, six days a week, 12 hours a day, as a produce delivery guy for a major produce company in Tucson that sold to hotels and restaurants and you know big campuses and stuff like that. It was a, no, it was a. You know it was a dead end job and it worked my tail off and I originally was in prayer because I wanted to get another part-time, a different kind of job that, even if it paid a little less, just so I could have a life and maybe look for another job. And that's when I said I just felt this impression in prayer. It says get up right now, go to the phone, call the university. I want you to go to school.
Speaker 4:As dumb as that, and everybody, my wife and the two friends I did tell. All thought that I was crazy. But that gee, that's nice that God thinks you could do something better with your life.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so it seems like faith is a central part of your life, then.
Speaker 4:Yeah, From absolutely I and I. I came to the Lord when I was actually on the street. Wow, and that's what led me to go back to get my GED.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 4:But I, I I've had serious cycle, you know emotional wounds and issues.
Speaker 4:Oh, wounds and issues from my childhood, the things that led me to become homeless at 13,. I thought I could leave those behind me, and I was always. My whole goal in life was do not let your past to define your future. But I it took, but it. I did have to go through a number of years of addictions and therapy and I lost my first wife and my daughter, and you know lots of hurts and relationship issues, lost one really good career because I couldn't contain myself and F-bomb my boss.
Speaker 4:You know the kind of thing that they don't put in the. You know how to win friends and influence. You know enemies list. And I and I'm not understanding why I would react that way, because I'm generally a very calm, rational, peaceful, loving, caring person and so it was this. It was sort of this Jekyll Hyde thing that I had to deal with for many years, and so even when I was successful, there was a part of me that wasn't really would never really rejoice in it or relish in it, because I always felt like, okay, don't rest on your laurels, what next? And so there was an obsessive driving forward for years.
Speaker 2:Well, I mean, you were dealing, and you said it, you had PTSD. You were dealing with a lot of hurt and a lot of trauma and, frankly, you probably didn't know how to process it and you were doing just as good as you could do, no idea how to process it and, to be fair, none of the psychologists or therapists, none of them, understood that at the time either.
Speaker 4:It took years before they realized oh, ptsd can happen to other people and more, and define what it meant, particularly in children. That went on for complex PTSD, which meant it went on for years and years. And so it it. I can talk about it now. I could never even talk about it until pretty much when I got close to retirement. Yeah, and it finally finally got diagnosed, but it was because I couldn't. I was, I wasn't happy. It was because I couldn't, I wasn't happy, I was ashamed of the fact that I had these weaknesses. I couldn't explain and I couldn't rationalize and I couldn't discipline myself away. Yeah Right, and they would hit me when I least expected it. It was always like an ambush right. So it took me a while before I could even figure out what it was or talk about it and then deal with it enough where I could feel safe mentioning it.
Speaker 2:Well, I'm glad you got it figured out and it seems, I mean, you know, look at, look at all those success you've had. By all accounts, it seems like you've dealt with it and then it's moved on. Let me ask you this guy when, when you're just sitting at home and you know there, no pressure, no external influences, and it's just you and your thoughts, what is, what do you like to do? What do you want to do? What does your mind gravitate?
Speaker 4:oh, my mind gravitates. I, if I had the money, um, I would be traveling all over the place. Um, you know, just just seeing the world, learning the, the history, absorbing the architecture, absorbing the culture, eating the good food not the buggy kind and diving and sailing, that was what I thought my life would be. But what it's become is sort of almost, in a sense, a mission. Because I've seen so many things going on in real time and because I did have an expertise in complex systems model building, I tend to see the world and I've got a master's in economics and I tend to see the world in all of these connected layers right, and so I look at sort of. I can take sort of the hyperbole on each side and discount the hyperbole, but then core down to what are the core operational things going on that are not necessarily going in the right direction. And, and so I think, writing.
Speaker 4:When I retired, I knew I wanted to become an author. I knew I wanted to become an author that was well respected, and but I wanted to become an author that was well respected, but I wanted to write intelligent. I was inspired by Michael Crichton. Michael Crichton is a brilliant guy. He did a PhD by training, but when he was concerned with the issues of DNA manipulation and cloning, he didn't write a white paper or an article for Science magazine to talk about why this was a bad idea, because really it wasn't the technology itself that was a bad idea, but it was the common problem of what happens when you take a powerful advanced technology and you put it in the hands of you know, in the face of greed, hubris and pride, you know bad things can happen. Yeah.
Speaker 4:And so I, early on, had been in, I'd been involved in implementing early stage AI since the 90s and had some experiences that that led to kind of some of my novels, and so I had so many different experiences. I wanted to write about them and in a context where I could put it in a narrative, where it would engage people, entertain people, get them to turn the page and then get them to think about the issues underlying it, without telling them exactly what to think about that. And so that's kind of when I went and part of that started with. There were actually two different events that really kind of combined together. That really kind of started that actually maybe three.
Speaker 4:But um, but one of the main events was when I read a very short net um associated press article. That was one of the you know, those kind of blurbs you get in the back of a magazine where they're just trying to fill pages and it's like you know no more than four sentences at most right, and it simply said, and almost verbatim, that a program has escaped the Lawrence Livermore Laboratories at Sandia and if I knew anything to contact X FBI agent or X professor at the Sandia labs. And I looked at that and I went, I did a huh and I read it again A program has escaped the Lawrence Livermore labs at Sandia. Well, I happen to know that those particular laboratories are part of an NSA. Darpa uses them for espionage. It was the same lab that helped create the Stuxnet virus. And so this is an NSA, this is an espionage lab for data tools.
Speaker 4:And I thought, well, that's weird. And I thought, well, it's got to be a typo. The program didn't escape, it was lost, it was stolen. Somebody trying to stole the program or the program malfunctioned and did something weird. But it was like, okay, it escaped and they were looking for it. They can't find it. And then the thought came to me so what if it's not? What if it's not a typo? What if it's a slip? Stupid, ridiculous slip. Somebody said something, somebody overheard something and it got into a magazine.
Speaker 4:So I cut it out and I taped it to my monitor. And because I get these obsessive, I can't get the problem out of my head. I just get weird that way, my head. I just get weird that way. My wife calls me the absent-minded professor. She said you want me to just throw your dinner under the door tonight. And so I spent in my spare time.
Speaker 4:I spent over a year trying to figure out what escape could mean. What would that look like technically? How could that be done? Was there an architecture to actually do that? And then why would they do that? Why would they create an application that could do that? And I went to a friend of mine who was an indie film producer at the time and we talked about it and we came and said this is the essence of a great story. And at that time I was just guessing right. But I had all of this technical knowledge that built up and make it plausible. I said, well, this is plausible and so let's build it. And so we decided to build a webisode series and we did. It was called Cracks in the Web. Hugely popular. We got like 24, 25 web awards. We got optioned by one of the studios. My fans were everywhere, from China to Israel, to Europe, to actually the director of flight operations for the NASA Houston Operations Space Center, his alias. He emailed me several times under the alias orbit at NASAgov. And so, two weeks before the studio option was to come due, we wanted to try and see if we can put this into a full production. And I had, on my own dime, hired out-of-work actors and we did film shoots and we wrote the scripts and it was this fully produced thing. It was pretty cool.
Speaker 4:Two weeks before the option comes due, two FBI agents knock on my door. Now at first I thought they were a joke from my friend, jack, who was helping me with all this. And they showed me the badges and they looked legit and they came in and of course they were very upset that I had figured out their top secret program. And what bothered them even more was my snarky attitude, because I was so giddy. At that point I was like, yes, yes, yes, I did it, I figured it out. You wouldn't be here if I was wrong. I'm going to tell all my friends hey, show me your badges again. So after they did a little bit of a pale white, look at each other, what do we do now. They gave me the we are not amused speech. My wife came home and gave me the honeywire. There are two FBI agents in my dining room. This better be a damn good story speech. Why are there two FBI agents in my dining room? This better be a damn good story speech.
Speaker 4:And that was the inspiration for the espionage series of Swarm that and the last arc that I started, and both of them have won Reader's Favorite Gold Award for Swarm, silver Award for the last arc.
Speaker 4:So I know I'm resonating with someone, and the whole purpose of that was to try and start to look at the knowledge I had been building around AI no-transcript purpose there in writing the books, now the, the other purpose, actually tied into prophetic themes and which was a, the, the idea, the creative idea to combine this idea of a growing power of artificial intelligence through the evolutionary phases it's likely to go through in the next several years, with sort of the combining that with sort of the global effects of climate, geopolitical change and disruption and radicalization, miscommunications, deepfake technologies, other things that are combining together, that are raising the anxiety of a lot of people worldwide.
Speaker 4:And so I wanted to just feed off of that natural overripe fruit and create a series of novels that not only pull these things together and connect the dots, put it in prophetic themes, but really make it about humanity and make it human terms. It can't be dystopic, it can't be overly technical, it can't be overly political, it can't be overly military, but it's got to make it, put us in touch with those things and provoke some human emotions.
Speaker 2:So the things that you have written have kind of been mirrored the things that you have experienced. So let me ask you this you said you got involved with AI back in the 90s.
Speaker 4:Wasn't called AI back then. By the way, it was actually. We were working on expert systems. By the way, it was actually, we were working on expert systems.
Speaker 2:Right, yeah, that's what. And so you know most people think AI is new and you know their first encounter with it was using Chad GPT or something. But you know these expert systems are.
Speaker 4:These early AIs have been around really as long as integrated circuits have existed. Well, the first there was. The first conference on artificial or machine intelligence occurred in 1956 at Dartmouth University. Members of DARPA and the DoD were in attendance, as well as a number of other university professors and other technical specialists. Ibm one of the guys that started Intel, rather was at the conference as well, and so we've been working on various versions of how to create a machine that could think for 60 years and over 60 years, and there have been major slash and burn failures. There have been a lot of over expectations, there've been a lot-hype and we're still we're in a little bubble of hype right now. I expect that bubble to pop when some of the realities don't work out exactly as fast as people are thinking, but they're actually happening faster than we thought. Now. A lot occurred until about it was about 2012-ish or so.
Speaker 4:One of the realizations we had was that AI needed way, way, way, way more data than we had at the time, which was one of the key benefits and drivers of the big data drive that happened in the late 90s through like 2012, 2016. There's a huge push on creating massive data stores of trillions of bytes, just massive stores of just about everything within organized or structured environments and unstructured environments, pulling in everything off of the Internet. And that ability to attack, connect that kind of broad-level data was a key. And the other key was trying to develop what we call artificial narrow intelligence, the very narrow type of expertise around machine intelligence where it's not necessarily thinking or pulling all of these things into context. And a good example of that is teaching the machine on how to detect a cancer cell from a CAT scan. And they can now do that faster and with more higher accuracy than a human. But that took a while to train. We had to train it on that, which meant that we needed human interaction. And then we started using other modalities like speech and text and images and videos. And all of those modalities required a level of training right so that the image, so that the computer would know that that's a cat's tail as opposed to something else, and what part of the cat it was and how to connect that with the rest of the cat. And there were years of training that companies were doing at Adobe, other companies, ibm, microsoft, google were doing on how to train machines on narrow things.
Speaker 4:A big one came and it started the thinking process of thinking and analyzing came when we started, we had the big blue machine basically beat the world champion in chess and that was a huge deal that a machine could actually outmaneuver a world champion in chess, and that was a huge deal that a machine could actually outmaneuver a world champion in chess. But in truth what the machine had done was study that world champion's moves over and over, and over, and over and over again until it could come up with new schemes to beat it. And the Google Alpha project was the next really big thing where it was a thinking algorithm, that basically where the computer would learn on its own all of the ways to fail and all of the ways to succeed and come up with moves that people even hadn't thought of yet in order to beat the Chinese game of Go. And that was another big, big key. Then we had what I call the multi, the ability to combine the modalities, when we started getting computers to say, well, to look at an image of a cat and then describe what a cat is, what it eats and how it sounds. So we have the modalities of speech and sound and movement, and now we're working on.
Speaker 4:We're in the next phase where we're working on higher mathematics and sciences and some of the more technical areas that require much more training right. So we've got some of the consumer stuff carried. So we're in this progress. We've been in this it's a long way of saying we've been in this long chain of development stages and I've been kind of watching it and either involved or studying and watching and researching those phases as they go through. So when I wrote the book Swarm in 2018, 2019, and I published it in 2020, I was already anticipating the chat, gpt, large language model abilities, along with a number of other abilities that aren't mentioned, you'll never hear about in social media or mostly on the internet, because they're more military, government, other types of activities that are going on. What would they be doing with this technology?
Speaker 4:So I'm always trying to write a few years ahead of the curve.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there's a lot there, Guy. Let me ask you this, going back to some of this AI stuff based on all your research and all of the insights that you have, if you were going to put, compare the evolution or the progression of AI to, say, the computer revolution, where would you put us, like the eight bit computer, or the XT, or the Pentium? Where? Where would you put us?
Speaker 4:Yeah, that's a good question. We're probably at the first version of Windows.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 4:Or maybe the early versions of Apple, where we're putting together images, sounds and text and things together, but the computer still can't do a whole lot of real projections or analysis. It really requires a lot of human activity to really kind of make it all stick together still. But unlike the computer curve, which was according to Moore's law, we were basically increasing at about 150% every year or so.
Speaker 4:right, the recent years of AI technology have been growing by bounds of tenfold and that's one of the reasons that in 2022, I think it was, and I'm confusing my years now Max Tegmark of MIT Artificial Intelligence Lab issued an open letter that 30,000 AI experts, policymakers, engineers and others signed saying we should pause on development of AI for six months so that we could get together and start to grapple with some of the risks and control and boundary issues legislation what are the ways we need to control this technology before it gets out of hand, rather than waiting for it to get out of hand and then trying to deal with that? Unfortunately, not a single lab complied with that letter, because there's far too much money.
Speaker 4:There's well over 200 and probably 25 billion dollars invested so far in ai technologies and those investors want to return on their investment yeah, and now the any nobody wanted to give up six months of development time, fearing that somebody else would cheat and then get ahead of them well, they probably would have to be, to be frank.
Speaker 2:But now the it's recursive because the ai is is being used to improve the ai. So exactly, you know, this is what makes ai so dangerous to any other technology that we've.
Speaker 4:It's recursive because the AI is being used to improve the AI, exactly and this is what makes AI so dangerous to any other technology that we've ever done right, which is we've now got the machine able to code itself. We've now got machines able to improve themselves at not human rates of learning but at machine rates of learning, and we now have machines being able to lie. We have machines learning to act like humans. We have machines able to act as agents, to interact and engage with other systems and talk with other machines in languages the developers don't quite understand, make changes to their code. The developers don't quite understand, and so we've never had a nuclear bomb that could create another nuclear bomb. But now we have machines that are growing in intelligence at a rapid rate, able to replicate themselves, and right now there's absolutely no boundaries on guardrails on that path.
Speaker 2:And here's the thing I don't think people understand. They're just like well, just unplug it. The predecessor to the internet was DARPAnet, and that was designed to be a self-healing network that could survive a nuclear blast and that eventually evolved into the Internet. The problem with AI is that it can be distributed.
Speaker 4:Exactly, which is the exact scenario I put in the book.
Speaker 4:Oh, really the exact scenario I put in the book swarm. Oh really, and with that scenario, that enabled the program to escape is that it could replicate itself elsewhere. Erase the log trails. Well, it was as simple as that. Um and. But we now have that's. And you're right, we? We don't really.
Speaker 4:When people say just unplug the machine, they they forget that some of these machines are on vast neural networks, networks consisting of thousands of computers, and just shutting it down is not something you can do easily. And we're at a point now ChatGPT, which is on GPT Platform 4, had tested an IQ of 155. Now, that's only five points lower than Einstein, smarter than 99% of the people on the planet. Now, it doesn't have an agent component, yet it can't actually act on what it knows or what it's regurgitating or has learned. But we're within.
Speaker 4:If AI is growing at tenfold, we're really, within 12 months or more, within cheap A computers and there's actually more than one version they're testing this high. That'll be smarter than a human. Now, if a, if I'm smarter than a human and I detect that I might be just unplugged, what's to keep me from replicating myself someplace else because I'm connected to the internet, or hacking the stock market and holding it hostage. We don't't know, we can't assume that an intelligent entity of some type, of a machine type that's learned mostly from human behavior and activity and history and actions won't be passive under that question of being unplugged.
Speaker 2:And the media has been trying to warn us of this for years. There was war games, there was Terminator all know all this stuff and sometimes life imitates art, sometimes art imitates life. But I'll give you I was an engineer at IBM and I'll give you a couple of notes that I have and maybe you can correlate. In the early 2000s we programmed a computer with living DNA. With living DNA they were also able to transport molecules a very short distance, from one pad across the dust to the other pad through the air. So, like a transporter technology, we were able to do that. And then the other thing that IBM did is they got a contract around that same time to develop a computer that was purportedly for modeling weather systems, and that was not its true purpose. Its true purpose was for analyzing communications captured through Carnivore and Echelon. Um and um, you know, um, those those you know you talk about. How, uh, chat, gpt can't, uh, can't, act on its knowledge, right now at least, and at least the version they make available. Who knows what's in development?
Speaker 4:version. But that's that's part of my point, which is that we're always two to three years ahead in the laboratory and it has nothing to do with what the governments are doing in the laboratory. Some of the you know, and and I I'm sure I won't ever know many of the things the governments are doing, but I was able to determine a few things and I can, I can use my imagination, just like I did the first time, saying, well, if I were the government and I had these, these types of military control, esp. Espionage, surveillance goals, what would I be doing with it? And it's not hard to imagine to put that mindset on and then basically take the technology premise and say, well, I'd be building this, that or the other thing, and so would my enemy. And so Swarm.
Speaker 4:The book Swarm deals with a drone swarming technology that DARPA is working on right now in the Nevada desert. And we're not talking about the big giant missile delivering kind of drones. We're talking about weaponized 18-inch drones that basically can swarm in packs of 1,000 or 10,000. And you know, imagine having an enemy village surrounded by these things where they're penetrating walls and alleyways and finding, you know, the combatants wherever they are and surrounding them and exploding on them. I mean it's a terrifying technology. And the question I always have is, being involved in technology for so many years, gee, what can go wrong? And that's what you have to ask. You say it's good if it works perfectly as designed. Nothing ever works perfectly as designed and there's always human error involved. What could go wrong? And so we can look at these things, look at what's going on and then kind of project that forward. So yeah, there's now part of this is going to is my research is leaning into quantum computing or amorphic computing or amorphic being kind of a combination of quantum and binary.
Speaker 4:Both of those are advancing at hyper accelerated rates. Three years ago, when I released Swarm, the most powerful quantum computer at the time was the D-WaveX, which had about 100 qubits to it. This year IBM released a Condor, a massive 1,121 qubit quantum computer with redundancy. And for those who don't know, every time you add a single qubit to the platform you double its capacity. So we basically in three years may have gone from added roughly 2.5 million times as much capacity than we had three half years ago.
Speaker 4:And that kind of enormous, powerful growth is important because, according to Sir Roger Primrose, the essence of consciousness can't exist in a binary platform alone. It takes a quantum computational power, a quantum nature, where you can have more than one possibility existing at a time to reach that stage of consciousness that we experience. And it probably won't be like what we experience, it'll probably be something different, it'll be closer to the theory of that reality as a simulation for a computer. But we're moving along that path and I believe that we're probably my guess is roughly three years away from that threshold, if not sooner, in the lab.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so in Swarm it deals with AI and prophecies. To what extent do you think there is some correlation?
Speaker 4:Well, in my book Swarm, and in this whole series that Swarm, last Ark, and the next book which will come out called the Image, the program that escaped the NSA is created into a character called Sylvia, a sophisticated language, virtual intelligence, called WM, by the lead protagonist improving it manually, improving its code to give it more modern machine learning and all these other new capabilities, and it's moving along the progress of a superintelligence and then a conscious superintelligence. And so I'm using that character of Sylvia, the program that escaped, as the character that, as far as I know, as far as anyone knows, is still loose on the Internet, to continue to illustrate this progress. Now in the series, the Sylvia decodes in time prophecy. One of the things I wanted to do in the book was to be able to combine technology, geopolitics, which includes economics, and spiritual, religious prophecy themes. One because I find that correlation extremely interesting and fascinating and creates lots of interesting scenarios that I could explore, and two, because I think there's a reality there. Now, I mentioned earlier that I developed complex systems for a number of years and early in my career until I got into lead management to.
Speaker 4:I grew up at the time when the Left Behind series was very popular and I remember at the time reading it and thinking to myself well, it's interesting, but it's wrong. It's obviously got a lot of incorrect notions about the world and how the world works. The idea that there would be one leader ruling over the entire world was to me an improbable, if not impossibility from a statistical perspective, given all the cultural, geopolitical, other divides that we had. So that was a misinterpretation and I felt that there were a lot of biases. And over the years I've seen biases and we've all heard them. You know, the Pope is the Antichrist and only the Protestants are really saying that. Or some Christians in America will say, well, islam is the Antichrist, but they don't really look at the attributes, they haven't really looked and studied it from a analytical perspective. Say what are the attributes? Does it meet the attributes? If not, then it doesn't fit. And so I wanted to have, rather than going along with the hype or also being blind to the obvious, I said, well, there has to be a logical, rational, more objective way of declaring or analyzing whether or not we were living in prophetic times or just simply chaotic times with lots of incredible, radical change. Right? And so I decided I was actually reading a National Geographic article about loss of fish stocks. Geographically China, asia, you know, america, south America, europe, everywhere and it was a giant study, or a combination of a bunch of studies from all over the world that had basically concluded that almost every single region around the world the fish stocks were down by roughly 30% or more. And for whatever reason? Because I had studied prophecy and read Revelation several times, trying to understand it myself, it clicked on me.
Speaker 4:A prophecy called the seven trumpets Now the seven trumpets. There's an allegory. The allegory is a flaming rock falls into the sea and the outcomes, the attributes of the prophecy, are a third of the fish of the sea die, a third of the birds of the air die, a third of the beasts of the land die and two-thirds of the rivers of the earth are so polluted you can't drink from them. Well, at the time I was working for a big oil company and I was responsible for a lot of our environmental EPA recommendations and implementation, all the way up to recommendations to the board of directors, and so I was very deeply involved with a lot of the environmental issues and studies and I realized that all of those things in that prophecy had already occurred. We were already well into the sixth extinction at that point and it was being well documented and I started realizing a number. I started saying, well, wait a minute, what if I twist the algorithm in my head a little bit? I said, well, what if prophecy is less about some God coming down to destroy humanity as much as a series of warnings about how, what would it look like when we destroy ourselves? And so I decided to. I could build a model on that. I could separate, I could do a correlation between attributes of a prophecy and documented world events and come up with a hundred percent, ninety hundred percent correlations, and then I could calculate the probability of that event relative to known human and geologic history, and then I could generate a cumulative probability of those events where that could lead into a regression model. The basic types of algorithms that we used in complex systems modeling and similar to many of the algorithms used in early stage and maybe even still modern stage AI right, the ability to take large pieces of data, find the patterns and create a regression. And I thought, well, I could do this with a number of prophecies and historic events. So I did.
Speaker 4:I spent a long three-day weekend. My son was at my ex-wife's house. I had gone to the library and my research source and got a bunch of factual data. I spent one day basically loading data into the system, another day building algorithms on a system that we had Because we were an oil company. I had all of these applications available to me. We had 100 million years or hundreds of millions of geologic data and I built these algorithms and I built these probability models and I did the regression model and I came up at the end of the night I think it was like 9 or 10 o'clock at night on a Sunday. I was exhausted but I was getting done. I figured, okay, I only did about 20 different trillion to one that we had entered into prophetic times.
Speaker 4:Now, at the time I thought, ok, well, I made.
Speaker 4:Maybe I made a mistake.
Speaker 4:Now you know, maybe I input, I did a data error on the input.
Speaker 4:Maybe I had too many digits on one number. That threw everything off. Maybe I screwed up my algorithms and I had a bias in my algorithms threw everything off. Maybe I screwed up my algorithms and I had a bias in my algorithms. I thought, okay, well, even if I'm over by a factor of a thousand, that's still a pretty big, impressive number. And it started me thinking about prophecies in different ways more systemic ways, more less dogma oriented and more fact oriented and more correlation oriented, and looking at world systems in different ways to kind of filter through where are the attributes lining up. And so I gave that power to the computer because I wanted to have this conversation of what are the things that we're doing, that are, what are the signs of that we're basically reaching, you know, kind of coming into our own demise in plain sight, that we're not seeing. And how do I build those into a narrative, an espionage narrative about an AI and a group of hackers, and so that became a major theme, and it was not usual.
Speaker 4:You don't really typically get an AI novel that has the premise based on an actual program that escaped, nor do you typically get one where it somehow develops this emergent property.
Speaker 4:Now, for those who don't know, an emergent property is when an AI develops a set of skills that the developer never anticipated, and we've had some amazing emergent properties, including programs learning how to. And we've had some amazing emergent properties including programs learning how to learn research-level chemistry, programs teaching themselves how to read minds using MRI scans, programs learning how to create different moves in games that were never considered or thought of before. So we have a number of emergent properties as examples, and they always learn about them as an accident, by mistake. It's not something we can be aware of and list all the emergent properties, because we just simply don't know we may not have learned them yet. So I put this in as an emergent property so that I could remove some of the religious fear of fervor around the topic and get it into more of a. Let's observe what's going on and then ask ourselves the question does it correlate and what do I think about it.
Speaker 2:Well, I'll tell you guys, swarm is going to be on my short list of things to read, because this sounds fascinating to me, Um, and clearly this is right up my alley of things that I enjoy learning about, but I want to ask you just a completely off the wall question, uh to to. So, based on all your calculations, everything that you've done, what do you think 666 is?
Speaker 4:Oh, wow, that's an interesting one. I think that one of the things I determined in prophecy is to be very careful not to try and use it to predict the future, because that's where we tend to get wrong, and then we get those ideas stuck in our head and then, when the real thing comes along, we miss it Right. What I did in along those regards is I actually developed a set of attributes around. Now that really relates to two different things. It relates to the system, the, the beast system, right, the mark of the beast system, the mark of the beast, and it relates to a character that's sometimes called the Antichrist, but it's not always tightly associated with the character itself, but often it is because it's the number of a man. So what I ultimately did in my next book, the image will deal with the image of the beast concepts, right, all of that kind of concept, along with the dragon that stands over the beast, the beast with seven heads and all that kind of stuff. But we'll also look at what are the attributes that are typically assigned to what we call the Antichrist, and I've found about roughly 10 of them and have scriptural references, and I've taken the attributes of those 10. And I'm trying to look for characters that exist in the world stage today that fit all or 90% of those attributes, and there's only there's very few of them. So I don't know.
Speaker 4:In my mind I thought it might be something. If it's something associated with a man, it's associated with something in plain sight. Now, some people said it was associated with the mark. That may be as well, but it hasn't happened yet as far as I could tell, and so I'm careful about how I project it.
Speaker 4:But there's one thing I do note in my book is that of a character in the book who's based on a real character, where there's a uniquely I noticed it by accident character, where there's a uniquely I noticed it by accident a uniquely singular type of architectural design on a building that's sort of associated with him in a major way, which is an upside down pyramid with six blocks on each side of the pyramid, and this design basically takes up like a whole third of the building or whole quarter of the building, so there's a lot of floor space that basically is given up so they could have this architectural design at the bottom of the building of an upside down, inverted pyramid. Does that mean anything? Could be complete coincidence. I don't know you got to throw that out with you know you got to be able to kind of throw that out with the baby at the bathwater, you know, but it was just so.
Speaker 4:I think there's going to be I have a feeling that it's not going to be this complicated, overly complicated type of process to discover. It's probably going to be something in relative plain sight of prophecies that are similar to that, that are just factual things hidden in plain sight and we've just simply missed it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and you know there's all kinds of theories and you know prophecies are conspiracies, rather about prophecies that you know the beast is going to be involved with AI, or the beast is this person or that person that you know the beast is going to be involved with AI, or the beast is this person or that person, or you know there's some people believe that this has already happened, back in 70 AD and different things like that. I was just curious about your perspective, if you know, if you thought maybe the beast system or the mark of the beast had anything at all to do with ai.
Speaker 4:I think the beast is probably probably a person well, I think the image of the beast is part of the is. I told a friend of mine when I went to work with microsoft. He says I'm going to go work with microsoft, we're going to build the backbone for the image of the beast. Um, because the image of the beast is going to was. I knew it would be internet based. Because and it would also involve ai, because you're dealing with something that reflects all aspects of the human civilization this beast system that we've created a worldwide interconnected network of systems of banks and trade and policing, and surveillance and information and education and people and personal information this whole thing that really reflects humanity in a microcosm, and now, with AI, has the ability to speak, and so I do believe that that's part of that system and what we're working at, which I don't know many people are aware of it, there's something called the Great Reset and the World Economic Forum is working on it. The Great Reset one of the primary it's essentially World Economic Forum is the most elite bankers, investors, policymakers from the major G7 and other G20 and other major nations coming together to create sort of policies for the Western alliance economies, and they're a derivative of one of other major groups, including the Davos Group, the Committee of 300, the Club of Rome, the Trilateral Commission, the Council on Foreign Relations, a number of groups that come out of the world, the UN as well, all derivative of a group that meets secretly every year called the Bilderbergs. And there's a power behind the Bilderbergs that most people, that I'm not even sure I know how to really peel back, but I've taken some of the folklore around it and built around that. But there is a coordinated effort. There is a small demon. I call those the dragon over the beast. Now we see in the revelation of beasts with seven heads, ten horns and ten crowns. Well, it's not hard to realize, and it wasn't until it didn't occur, until it was after 2000, where we had the G7, and if you look at the and that are representative of the top seven economies. But if you look behind the G7, to the rest of the Western Alliance and the NATO Alliance, there are still 10 monarchies that exist to this day. So those are the 10 crowns and there's 10 financial centers that basically drive most of 60% or more of the world economy. And so we have. If I look at attributes and I say, does anything fit the attributes? That fits the attributes.
Speaker 4:Now, last year, with the Great Reset, the World Economic Forum said that one of their goals was to replace the US dollar for international trade with a digital currency managed by a banking application with an AI function to it, so the AI can detect currency fraud. Ai could detect sanctioned violations, criminal violations, tax violations. They want to be able to use the AI to create and, with digital currencies, to create a more controllable international. They want more control of the money flow, both domestically and internationally, and they've stated this is one of their goals. It's in print and so we don't really have to look too far.
Speaker 4:And, by the way, the access to that system will be based on a digital identity. Now, for a lot of people, that's either their biometric identity, and I tell everybody don't use anything with a biometric identity. I refuse to use those because and here's a simple example If you lose your password, if somebody hacks your password, it's a pain in the ass. You can always reset your password and start a new account. If you lose your digital identity, if you get your thumbprint, your iris scan, your facial recognition, sucked up into the system, if that's hacked, there's no way you're ever getting your identity back.
Speaker 2:That's true.
Speaker 4:And Clearview. There's an example of this Clearview in 2001 had 2.1 million identities hacked and sold on the black market sold on the dark web, including a number of government employees.
Speaker 2:Now, who buys that?
Speaker 4:information on the dark web is largely China.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know I'm kind of taken back and we're coming up on the end of our time here, but I want to make a last comment and then I'll let you say your closing bit. But you know, all these cryptocurrencies and digital currencies were created because it was quote decentralized and eluded the control of any government, and actually this is what's going to facilitate it all.
Speaker 4:Really, Well, yeah, but it was just a matter of time before these became tools of the central banks. Right, and the Federal Reserve has already they have. Federal Reserve keeps saying that they have no plans to adopt it right now, but they have been testing it and they there's one of the comments that I've read is that this is from Klaus Schwab, who's the head of the World Economic Forum is that it'll take a major global crisis event, a disruptive event, in order for them to lower the resistance at all the national levels in order to implement this, and there's speculation that either Ukraine or Israel could be one of those events.
Speaker 2:It's problem reaction solution. They've already got the plan, They've already got the system, they're just waiting for.
Speaker 4:They're just waiting for the right time. Yeah, go ahead.
Speaker 2:They're just waiting for the righteous indignation of a public crying out for the solution they've already engineered us to accept.
Speaker 4:Exactly and use the media to, to, you know, butter us up to make sure we're okay with it. Yeah, and so one of the reasons I write the books is to try and help people become aware of the fact that all of these things are a prophetic b, not necessarily in your favor. Um, they're. They're power grabs by the elite and if, if power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely AI will become the absolute power grab of all. And how that, at an international level, is going to create a competition that could take us into the kind of nobody wants to think about a World War III. That's nuclear, but that's a possibility. Certainly not a done deal, but we're really kind of edging up close to that. You combine that with climate, lots of water supplies, food issues and shortages starting to crop up, population shrinking in major industrial companies and countries and growing in other developing countries. We've got some economic upheavals ahead of us in the next few years countries.
Speaker 2:we've got some economic upheavals ahead of us in the next few years. Guy, I'd like to have you on again if you want to come on again, because there's some other things I want to talk to you about and I'll just leave you with this thought. Maybe we can talk about this next time.
Speaker 4:But if AI becomes smarter than all of humanity throughout all of time put together all at once, and if it's all-knowing and if, because it's distributed, it's now everywhere, those are at least two qualities of the divine it's omniscient and omnipotent thoughts um that is certainly a real possibility uh, and there's a lot of what is and variables in terms of whether it's a high probability, based on how humans react and whether or not we act in time, but it certainly is a an um, a question mark and an initiative and a question that a lot of people are going to, are worried about, and I'm in one of them.
Speaker 4:The one of the other questions is will we ultimately, and will it happen? What will come first? Our own destruction or the super, or the deity, ai deity? And there's a question mark there where there will last long enough for that reality to be the right one, because in order for that to happen, we actually have to survive this next several years, where China is threatening to take over Taiwan, russia basically hell bent, and taking over the Eastern Bloc, and Israel has basically bent on and pissing off and going to war with their enemies and the you know the natural, economic, and we're going to be having a election here in the US that will define our democracy in a major way and perhaps the end of it in a major way, and so there's a lot of big unknowns to know whether or not we'll actually get to the development stage of an AI deity. But if we last long enough, that is certainly a theoretical possibility.
Speaker 2:Well, let's connect after this and figure out where we're going to get you back on the schedule real quick. How can folks find you? Do you have a website and where are your books at?
Speaker 4:Absolutely. Go to GuyMorrisBookscom. That site will give you trailers. It will give you information about the books, including fact versus fiction pages for each book, which I ask people don't read until after you've read the story first and then go back and figure out how much of it is based on reality. Um, but there's also reviewed links and you can buy from my website. My press kit and all kinds of other things are there.
Speaker 2:Patrick Bass show. Thanks so much for listening. Uh, we're going to have him back. We'll pick this up again at another time. Uh, check us out tomorrow. We got another great guest coming to you tomorrow at 5 PM, centralm Central. Take care.
Speaker 1:Thanks for listening to the Patrick Bass Show. The Patrick Bass Show is copyright 2024, all rights reserved. Patrick's passion is to open up any and all conversations because in this day and age, the snowflakes are scared to get real. We'll fly that flag till the very end, that we can promise you. Keep updated by liking our Facebook page at Real Patrick Bass. For more information, visit us on the web at wwwpwbasscom. Thanks for listening and tune in next time for more real talk on the Patrick Bass Show.
